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Tour Cancellation
Good afternoon! Please advise on the next step. I ordered vouchers (to Turkey) for two days 2 days ago (by phone with a travel agent, no contract was concluded, the trip was planned for the end of May). For objective reasons (family circumstances) they refused to travel, which was reported to the agent. She replied that the reservation had already been confirmed and would cancel it. Yesterday I sent a letter (by e-mail) stating that the operator has set a fine of 30 USD for the cancellation. Today, this is 930 rubles. Is this action legal? Do I have to pay this fine? And at what rate is it considered (the rate at the operator at the time of booking was 30.65 rubles). Thank you very much in advance!
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Answers • 39
but how could they book a tour without paying a deposit, especially without checking you for departure (I think this is a scam) (I also canceled a last minute trip, my child got sick, but the contract was on the phone, I called and there were no problems)
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5.5
answered 11 years ago
This is not the first time we book with this TA. Purely trust...
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answered 11 years ago
You can contact the operator and check if this is the case. If the cancellation really costs that much, then, in my opinion, it would be decent to pay, especially since you are booked by phone without prepayment. From a legal point of view, there is no contract - you owe nothing.
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8
answered 11 years ago
This is illegal. According to the Law "On Protection of Consumer Rights", the client has the right to terminate the contract at any time before its execution. TA is entitled to withhold from you only the amount of expenses ACTUALLY INCURED by him, providing you with written confirmation of such. In this case, there were no such costs. Do not pay, your conscience will be clear. Go to our regional consumer protection website, get the exact same answer!
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answered 11 years ago
Well, TA can claim that $30. are the costs actually incurred if the TO bills them for the cancellation. There is no contract with the tourist, therefore, TA will pay, i.e. agent himself :(
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6
answered 11 years ago
All court cases on this topic were won by tourists. It is a fact.
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3
answered 11 years ago
those. legally can not pay penalties? but in conscience - it seems like it should?? on the one hand, TA did not inform me about penalties (especially from the moment of booking to refusal, no more than 6 hours passed), and on the other hand, she trusted me at the moment when I called TA and asked to book a tour...
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answered 11 years ago
The choice, however)) Then decide for yourself, maybe not the last time you are applying to this TA. But legally they shouldn't!
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1.5
answered 11 years ago
Can I ask her for some documents confirming the issuance of penalties (especially since less than 6 hours have passed from the moment of booking to refusal) (although sometimes they don’t confirm it so quickly)
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2
answered 11 years ago
TA fines are issued by the regional representative of the tour operator. TA will easily show you such a piece of paper. Try calling the customer service center and asking them. In either case, he violates the TO by issuing a TA penalty.
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1.5
answered 11 years ago
The amount of the fine depends on many factors. You need to find out why it was put up for you, you can visit your agent and find out everything on the spot. Of course, by booking without a contract, you may not pay a fine, but I think in this case you will lose your agent.
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answered 11 years ago
If you are ready to give up good relations with an agent (after all, not every tourist has access to such a service - booking by phone with complete confidence), then you don’t have to pay - the written agreement was not concluded, only in words an agreement.
But I would pay, of course. And then I would turn to this agent.
But I would pay, of course. And then I would turn to this agent.
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2
answered 11 years ago
I think that TA has not yet paid anything for MOT without you making an advance payment, and there may not be any penalty for canceling the tour. The fine is set, and it is exactly $ 30 for some MOTs, even if this is an early booking and cancellation occurred such a long time before the start of the trip. Is it difficult to find who is to blame now? I agree with the above recommendations that everything depends on you if you want to leave such a trusting relationship between TA and you. I advise you to go to TA and find out everything, maybe they just don't want to cancel. And what was confirmed to you right away is possible, many hotels are with instant confirmation, often near Coral-Sanmar and Anex.
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answered 11 years ago
You can not pay, your travel agent will pay instead of you. :) But it is unlikely that in the future he will trust you at your word and book without prepayment.
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1
answered 11 years ago
A few clarifications.
1. There are almost always fines. For long periods before departure - small. And they are purely disciplinary in nature - maintaining responsibility for booking actions. Indeed, when booking, a whole chain of actions is immediately included: the sending office - the receiving office - the hotel and vice versa.
2. The size of the imposed fine is easy to find out. Offer the manager to show the booking in the operator's booking system. Everything is visible there.
3. The most important thing. The travel agent will not pay. The manager who took responsibility for booking without a contract and an advance payment will pay from his salary. specific girl. After that, for some time, all her regular customers will refuse to book by phone. Those. a number of worthy responsible people will also suffer.
And the end of the telephone conversation probably looked like this: "Did you decide?" - "Yes" - "Do we book?" - "We're booking!"
1. There are almost always fines. For long periods before departure - small. And they are purely disciplinary in nature - maintaining responsibility for booking actions. Indeed, when booking, a whole chain of actions is immediately included: the sending office - the receiving office - the hotel and vice versa.
2. The size of the imposed fine is easy to find out. Offer the manager to show the booking in the operator's booking system. Everything is visible there.
3. The most important thing. The travel agent will not pay. The manager who took responsibility for booking without a contract and an advance payment will pay from his salary. specific girl. After that, for some time, all her regular customers will refuse to book by phone. Those. a number of worthy responsible people will also suffer.
And the end of the telephone conversation probably looked like this: "Did you decide?" - "Yes" - "Do we book?" - "We're booking!"
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answered 11 years ago
HotLine, I specify from the point of view of the current legislation of the Russian Federation. Scars in the tourism business, indeed, take place. But in most cases they are OUT OF THE LAW. Here is an example where the penalty is justified. A tourist was issued a visa, a tour was booked, the visa was denied by the embassy due to circumstances that the tourist inadvertently kept silent. Federal legislation (Law of the Russian Federation No. 2300-1 "On the Protection of Consumer Rights" and the Civil Code of the Russian Federation) exceeds the dubious requirements of TA and TO. Of course, we don't like going to court. It's easier for us to pay. But this is a bad practice.
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answered 11 years ago
1. PolikSVT, You do not understand. Read carefully. I wrote about penalties in the relationship between TA and TO. They are not regulated by consumer protection law. And he wrote about who would really suffer if the topcaster refused to pay the fine. I repeat - the girl manager and her other conscientious clients will suffer, to whom she will now refuse to book by phone.
2. Regarding fines for tourists. In the legal sense of the word, they do not exist AT ALL. Not in any situations. If the buyer refuses the service, the seller of the service must return to the buyer all the money, except for the actual costs incurred. Such legal requirements. Including in the case you describe with some documents there.
2. Regarding fines for tourists. In the legal sense of the word, they do not exist AT ALL. Not in any situations. If the buyer refuses the service, the seller of the service must return to the buyer all the money, except for the actual costs incurred. Such legal requirements. Including in the case you describe with some documents there.
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answered 11 years ago
3. In the templates of contracts with tourists for tourist services, many operators have a scale of penalties. This is a long-established practice and this is not a violation of the law (if there are questions, I will explain why). But the tourist has the right to transfer monetary relations according to the “costs actually incurred” scheme.
An example that everyone can see for themselves. We all know that with the Russian Pegasus on their website, a tourist can book a tour on their own, bypassing a travel agency. When booking, the tourist puts a tick to agree with the terms of the contract.
Read paragraph 5.3. of this agreement. This is the largest clause in the contract. There are over 50 lines.
An example that everyone can see for themselves. We all know that with the Russian Pegasus on their website, a tourist can book a tour on their own, bypassing a travel agency. When booking, the tourist puts a tick to agree with the terms of the contract.
Read paragraph 5.3. of this agreement. This is the largest clause in the contract. There are over 50 lines.
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answered 11 years ago
I'll quote part of that paragraph:
“In case of refusal of the tourist product or any changes in the composition of the services included in the tourist product, at the initiative of the Customer and / or tourists, as well as in case of impossibility to make a trip for any reason beyond the control of the Contractor, including in connection with the refusal or the delay of the embassy / consulate of a foreign state in issuing a visa, the Customer undertakes, at the request of the Contractor, to pay the actual costs incurred by the Contractor (fines and other financial sanctions imposed on the Contractor by third parties in connection with the refusal of the tourist product and / or the inability to travel) in the following amount: ... "
4. Specifically, this case of a topicaster from a legal point of view. The operator imposed a fine on the agent for canceling the application on the basis of the terms of the agency agreement concluded between them. Question: Is this actually a cost incurred by the agent? Answer: is. Therefore, this fine is legally justified for the tourist as well. Another thing is that the contract was not signed and the money was not paid. Therefore, there are certain formal difficulties to transfer responsibility to the tourist. Therefore, the scheme of item 1 of the answer will work in life.
“In case of refusal of the tourist product or any changes in the composition of the services included in the tourist product, at the initiative of the Customer and / or tourists, as well as in case of impossibility to make a trip for any reason beyond the control of the Contractor, including in connection with the refusal or the delay of the embassy / consulate of a foreign state in issuing a visa, the Customer undertakes, at the request of the Contractor, to pay the actual costs incurred by the Contractor (fines and other financial sanctions imposed on the Contractor by third parties in connection with the refusal of the tourist product and / or the inability to travel) in the following amount: ... "
4. Specifically, this case of a topicaster from a legal point of view. The operator imposed a fine on the agent for canceling the application on the basis of the terms of the agency agreement concluded between them. Question: Is this actually a cost incurred by the agent? Answer: is. Therefore, this fine is legally justified for the tourist as well. Another thing is that the contract was not signed and the money was not paid. Therefore, there are certain formal difficulties to transfer responsibility to the tourist. Therefore, the scheme of item 1 of the answer will work in life.
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3
answered 11 years ago
HotLine, once again let me clarify for you about the primacy of the FEDERAL legislature. ANY contract can be recognized as infringing on the rights of a citizen and a consumer (if it really is), and it can be challenged in court. A MOT AND TA punish administratively or by court for the inclusion in the contract of clauses that infringe on the rights of the consumer and citizen. By and large, the contract is just a piece of paper, which, as you know, "tolerate everything"))
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answered 11 years ago
PolikSVT, I'm sorry, but I disagree with you here - an agreement between two legal entities has nothing to do with the rights of a citizen and consumer, as a third party.
Those. we have a TO-TA agreement, where it is not illegal to prescribe fines. And we have a TA-tourist agreement, where a fine is possible for "actually transferred expenses." These, in principle, include a fine paid by TA in favor of TO.
So here we are talking about some 30 dollars, no one will really understand. And when people are charged 90% of the penalty for canceling, for example, a New Year's tour to Mauritius ... And the actual costs incurred by TA are the same fine in favor of TO, and the costs incurred by TO are fines from a foreign host ... This is where the interesting begins. I would like to read about such precedents.
Those. we have a TO-TA agreement, where it is not illegal to prescribe fines. And we have a TA-tourist agreement, where a fine is possible for "actually transferred expenses." These, in principle, include a fine paid by TA in favor of TO.
So here we are talking about some 30 dollars, no one will really understand. And when people are charged 90% of the penalty for canceling, for example, a New Year's tour to Mauritius ... And the actual costs incurred by TA are the same fine in favor of TO, and the costs incurred by TO are fines from a foreign host ... This is where the interesting begins. I would like to read about such precedents.
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2
answered 11 years ago
PolikSVT, of course, the law is primary. Of course, you can challenge any contract in the subsequent chain, as infringing on the rights of a tourist.
But this does not mean that the fine scale is illegal by definition. Moreover, as a person from the topic, I will say that it is real, factual.
We figured out the agent - he has an invoice for a cancellation penalty from the operator. Do you really think that the operator will not be able to show their actually incurred costs for the cancellation of the tour in the amount of 20-30 dollars?
Do you really think that there is no real, actual responsibility of the operator for the cancellation of the reservation to the hotel and the carrier? Do all types of penalties between the subjects of tourism, by definition, violate the rights of the end consumer?
Pachok, what's interesting about the 90% fine for Mauritius for the new year? There are more widespread examples that are perceived by everyone as understandable, not causing interest and not violating consumer rights. Non-refundable fares for air flights, fines for the return of railway tickets, the inability to return money for unused tickets for various cultural events, etc.
But this does not mean that the fine scale is illegal by definition. Moreover, as a person from the topic, I will say that it is real, factual.
We figured out the agent - he has an invoice for a cancellation penalty from the operator. Do you really think that the operator will not be able to show their actually incurred costs for the cancellation of the tour in the amount of 20-30 dollars?
Do you really think that there is no real, actual responsibility of the operator for the cancellation of the reservation to the hotel and the carrier? Do all types of penalties between the subjects of tourism, by definition, violate the rights of the end consumer?
Pachok, what's interesting about the 90% fine for Mauritius for the new year? There are more widespread examples that are perceived by everyone as understandable, not causing interest and not violating consumer rights. Non-refundable fares for air flights, fines for the return of railway tickets, the inability to return money for unused tickets for various cultural events, etc.
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answered 11 years ago
It is clear that legally zach23 may not pay this money, but from a purely human side, it is clear that the travel agent is either young or a very good friend who decided to book without prepayment.
zach23, write to us all after all, how did you solve this issue?
zach23, write to us all after all, how did you solve this issue?
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1
answered 11 years ago
Pachok, I clarified that not in all cases) I just have such reliable judicial practice regarding such fines that are issued by zash23, 100% of claims in favor of tourists) (yes, there are such mercantile tourists who go to courts) And that's what happens in situations like Mauritius), then there will be REAL expenses incurred by TA (cancellation deadlines are completely different).
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answered 11 years ago
And here another moment amused me.
The person asks to book a tour for him, and a day later (!!!) he refuses the tour "for family reasons" (c)
Such "tourists" should definitely be fined.
The person asks to book a tour for him, and a day later (!!!) he refuses the tour "for family reasons" (c)
Such "tourists" should definitely be fined.
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1
answered 11 years ago
After some tourists consider it a force majeure that their boss did not let them go on vacation, I am not surprised at anything.
I was amused that there is "reliable jurisprudence" for suing 30 dollar fines.
I was amused that there is "reliable jurisprudence" for suing 30 dollar fines.
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answered 11 years ago
"People asks to book a tour for him, and a day later (!!!) he refuses the tour "for family reasons" (c)"
Have you ever had something extremely important suddenly happen in your family? Both good and tragic...
Have you ever had something extremely important suddenly happen in your family? Both good and tragic...
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answered 11 years ago
HotLine, I can tell you about funny court cases when two successful businessmen (one seller - another buyer) are suing because of purchased low-quality beach slates worth 20 bucks))) In these cases, the principle "rules", not the amount of money))
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answered 11 years ago
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