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From Sharm to Israel How are things going with border control 2018, for Ukraine?
I read that Ukrainians have tightened control on the border with Israel and many are being returned back. This is true?
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Upon arrival in Bethlehem, a Russian-speaking nun from the temple was assigned to us, who gave us an amazing tour ... neither the first nor the third time (with a larger bus and compatriots) no one drove tourists along this route. The conclusion is that the chauvinists are the Israelis ... the British look into the tonsils, the former compatriots are more to collect money. (by the way, at the hotel during breakfast, they pulled out an envelope from my bag with money for excursions - $ 400, but - it was my own fault, I hung my purse on the back of a chair and went to get food, I saw that hotel employees were sitting nearby - they wrote some then a report, it didn’t even occur to me that I would be left without money ....) but maybe I’m unfair - chauvinists and a few boors are just not those who were born and grow up there, but just former fellow citizens who left for the earth I heard the promised - such a vile tirade - in Russian from one not very young Jew in an appeal to the same about those who come to the Dead Sea. Ugh. And now for the latest visit...
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1.5
answered 5 years ago
After the second - already definitely a targeted trip, for a week to Jerusalem, I already understood for sure that I was delighted with those who could make this land prosperous, but I definitely wouldn’t want to live there. But we went with dear godfather immediately after the New Year, for a few days to Egypt, and she, as she had never been to Jerusalem, really wanted to go there. Of course, she alone would not be comfortable among strangers, and I decided to keep her company ... on my own head. Really did not expect such a nightmare at the border. And this one, in the presence of almost all the pages for visas in my passport that are far from Egyptian and Turkish :). After reviewing all the leaves, the young lady languidly asked - why did you come to our country so often? My eyes widened in surprise, not exactly on my forehead. This is the question I expected least of all from a representative of a country that has chosen for itself the territory where one of the greatest monuments of mankind is located. If it’s already short, it’s almost night that the bus of anex-s still waited
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2.5
answered 5 years ago
"detainees" for additional checks of tourists (my fingers were rolled back), they didn’t let in only one, but I wouldn’t let him in either - is it possible to call a sane person who went on an excursion to Israel in clothes in the style of"military " and with some pieces of iron in the bag? But this young man was yanked out of the serpentine queue for testing almost immediately. As a result, about one and a half hundred people (not only the former CIS) spent almost a night waiting for the check, which no one was going to speed up with the working units of the checkpoint. We met the dawn, waiting for our tourists from the bus (until the last person) on Israeli territory, there was only one bio-toilet nearby, the door of which was held by a companion using the service, otherwise we would have to be on public display, well, I would have pulled it out into fresh air passed out from the wild stench inside. Later, a pleasant guide explained to us that there was a massive "lagging behind" from the groups, so if anyone is so tight, let her whisper in her ear,
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½
answered 5 years ago
so that with all the dogs not to search and not to arrange unnecessary hassle for everyone. The excursion had to "squeeze", the dawn on the mountain went down the drain, and this is really very beautiful, but in general, our dear young lady did an excellent job according to her program. We returned to the hotel just exhausted ... and now I have a dilemma: we are going to Egypt with a very large group. Part of her has never been to Israel and would really like to get there and is very sensitive to this topic ... that's why I dug up this forum - to see what has changed. It turns out it got even worse. I don’t know directly - let the people try, if they want. I will definitely betray the life hack of one of those who wrote - to take a minimum of things. (although, as a rule, the Dead Sea coast is on the list of excursions, and a towel and bathing things are needed, and this is a place in the luggage). Here's the question - no one thought about the reasons that resulted in such a requirement for security for those entering? Does anyone have an answer? :)
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answered 5 years ago
"Part of her has never been to Israel and would really like to get there and is very sensitive to this topic ..."
Don't your three trips teach them anything?
Don't your three trips teach them anything?
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answered 5 years ago
Well, the question has been asked and will have to be answered. Moreover, the author again goes to the individual. I never wrote about myself. Yes, I'm not indigenous, only 29 years old, but that's enough to fall in love with the country of Israel. Love with all the flaws and virtues. I am not a chauvinist, and if you think that a person, having publicly called an entire nation rotten, does not deserve condemnation, then I also have nothing to talk about with you. Moreover, if he lived in a legal state, I would sue him. People like you and him see themselves as BOSS over everyone and often don't think about the consequences.
Regarding hard-working and skillful hands - sorry, but you did better about bio-toilets. The Israeli government will decide for itself what kind of hands it needs and from where, and not every bricklayer or tiler from Ukraine. With their own hands, the Jews built a wonderful country in 70 years. Even you noticed it.
Regarding hard-working and skillful hands - sorry, but you did better about bio-toilets. The Israeli government will decide for itself what kind of hands it needs and from where, and not every bricklayer or tiler from Ukraine. With their own hands, the Jews built a wonderful country in 70 years. Even you noticed it.
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answered 5 years ago
About excursions. You again switched to personalities: what was the name of the guide, where did he come from. What was the main thing for you when visiting Jerusalem???? You did not say a word where you were and what you saw. Do you have anything left in your memory after 3 visits??? If you say that the Jews chose the country they are in - the history of the world, I feel sorry for your money and time spent on excursions. Because even the worst guide of "ours" told you that the Jews came here in the 18-19 century BC, that the Jews in Jerusalem built the First Temple in the 10th century BC, that Jesus was a boy Jewish parents and was born in Judea, that the Temple of Jerusalem was destroyed by the Romans in 70 and the Jews were expelled from Jerusalem!!! And after 2000 years they returned to their historical homeland from which they made a prosperous Israel. This is in short.
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answered 5 years ago
Concerning the organization of excursion. You and I know how much we paid for the tour with the British. And if a Russian tourist is ready to pay the same amount and not $ 30, then he will also be assigned security.
I answered the last question many times, who is to blame and what to do. But my answer does not suit you - after all, it is not the Jews who are to blame for it.
I answered the last question many times, who is to blame and what to do. But my answer does not suit you - after all, it is not the Jews who are to blame for it.
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1.5
answered 5 years ago
Michael, I carefully re-read all the correspondence and your texts. Have you reviewed them?
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½
answered 5 years ago
At first, I thought - here is a person with whom I can clarify some points, because:
1. The first trip was chaotic due to a not very successful guide, despite the fact that I was preparing for it.
2. The second trip - YES, I think it was a success, because it was disproportionately longer. But accidentally overheard conversations between emigrants from the scoop (I'm not going to step aside and close my ears, violating my personal comfort, but people are not embarrassed that they understand them, they said nasty things about those who come to the Dead Sea (themselves, as I understand it, consider themselves "almost rooted ")), spoiled the impression of the country, although later the positive nevertheless erased the sharpness of the insult, but the sediment remained.
3. The third trip - crossing the border - it was already something. I no longer want to go to Israel, even to support friends, although - according to your recommendations - the presence of a 10-year, almost fresh visa to the States in my passport, probably this time would definitely be convincing for the Israeli border control,
1. The first trip was chaotic due to a not very successful guide, despite the fact that I was preparing for it.
2. The second trip - YES, I think it was a success, because it was disproportionately longer. But accidentally overheard conversations between emigrants from the scoop (I'm not going to step aside and close my ears, violating my personal comfort, but people are not embarrassed that they understand them, they said nasty things about those who come to the Dead Sea (themselves, as I understand it, consider themselves "almost rooted ")), spoiled the impression of the country, although later the positive nevertheless erased the sharpness of the insult, but the sediment remained.
3. The third trip - crossing the border - it was already something. I no longer want to go to Israel, even to support friends, although - according to your recommendations - the presence of a 10-year, almost fresh visa to the States in my passport, probably this time would definitely be convincing for the Israeli border control,
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answered 5 years ago
that it would be better for me to stay in America, and not in Sinai ....
4. Not a word I mentioned the nationality of the workers. You specified that you are from Ukraine (did you look at my profile? You were not too lazy, this is a plus) And that's exactly why I firmly say - YES, you are a chauvinist. And this follows from all your subsequent opuses in this correspondence. You grumbled about many points, instead of admitting the correctness of what was written and, adjusting to the correspondence, even changed your mind about the situation with the remaining illegal immigrants.
5. I, of course, do not live in Israel and do not want to live there. But - if the state and the country were reborn on the land of their ancestors, then the people understand how hard it is for others. If there are monuments of world culture and religion in this territory, then for so much time it is possible to work out an algorithm for tourists. but - again (a manifestation of chauvinism), you just clarified that YES, an excursion with the British is cool, but everyone there from their former homeland is not worth attention and protection. directly soviet
4. Not a word I mentioned the nationality of the workers. You specified that you are from Ukraine (did you look at my profile? You were not too lazy, this is a plus) And that's exactly why I firmly say - YES, you are a chauvinist. And this follows from all your subsequent opuses in this correspondence. You grumbled about many points, instead of admitting the correctness of what was written and, adjusting to the correspondence, even changed your mind about the situation with the remaining illegal immigrants.
5. I, of course, do not live in Israel and do not want to live there. But - if the state and the country were reborn on the land of their ancestors, then the people understand how hard it is for others. If there are monuments of world culture and religion in this territory, then for so much time it is possible to work out an algorithm for tourists. but - again (a manifestation of chauvinism), you just clarified that YES, an excursion with the British is cool, but everyone there from their former homeland is not worth attention and protection. directly soviet
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7.5
answered 5 years ago
tradition to look into the mouth of foreigners... I don’t have such a trait in my genome, for me all peoples are equal, therefore such manifestations are very disgusting. And - if the same attitude on the border of ANY other state, I would have exactly the same disgust in my soul. Believe me, when I went on an excursion to Cambodia, then THERE is a border crossing - just fantastic - how can this work ?! - but for them everyone was equal - they stood in line, which was slowly moving, waited for a stamp with a smile and wishes to have a good time in their country ... and it really went wonderfully.
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answered 5 years ago
And about excursions. Believe me, when I go to some place that I dreamed of visiting since childhood, I definitely read a lot before the trip. Something is refreshed, something is recognized at all. And now I could even be a guide on a trip to Israel for my friends, with whom we are going to bask in the sun after our current difficult weather. But isn't this a knowledge reporting forum? excursions are all traditional. The fact is how the guide will present them to you. By the way, as a rule, there are two of them - to visit Bethlehem, you should have an Arab guide with a group. And each guide presents the history of THIS land from his own position.... In OUR current situation, I already understand them. I went THREE times on the same route with a difference in years. And every year the preparedness of the guides is getting better. But - the attitude at the border .... you mentioned Ukrainian guest workers with such disdain .... and I think - well, WHAT would my grandmother say to this? in which-Ukrainian-Polish blood mixed with Turkic? which the whole occupation
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answered 5 years ago
guarded two Jewish kids - brother and sister - under the guise of Kiev nephews, whom fate pushed into her gate? having her 7 children, being already a widow - did the scoop kill her loving and beloved husband during the Finnish campaign? Delhi grew up, returned to Kyiv, my sister became an artist and painted a portrait of my dad - her ward friend in childhood, my brother left for Israel literally with the first wave, my sister much later - I still remember her apartment near Sofiyivska Square and the doll that she and I proudly bought in a children's passage on Khreshchatyk, named her after ... yes. I delved into something else. In short - I want people to remain with memory, brain and mutual respect.
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8
answered 5 years ago
A bit comical, as it seems to me, is how a mishatour person, caught in a lie, tries to change concepts and talks about condemning others, but not himself. Should I be sued for what I think? Yes, indeed, this is possible only in a real legal state). I do not at all call an entire nation rotten and do not claim that this is actually the case. Maybe you are the most beautiful people on earth and the most holy, but I just don’t think so, that’s all! And I don’t mean the whole nation, and, of course, I think that the minority, or rather the few, are not at all. It turns out for you that the minority is not the people. And I think that if representatives of the country of Israel took part in the bullying of my children, and this is not a private shop for you, then most people will be responsible for this, whether they want it or not. This is my opinion, or rather, even the decision, and you have neither the strength nor the ability to change it.
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answered 5 years ago
"the presence of a 10-year almost fresh visa to the States in my passport, probably this time, would definitely be convincing for the Israeli border control"
For the first time I hear that the US visa somehow helps to pass the border with Israel ...
For the first time I hear that the US visa somehow helps to pass the border with Israel ...
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1.5
answered 5 years ago
linsrvc "Here's the question - no one thought about the reasons for which such a requirement for security for entrants became the result? Does anyone have an answer? :)" - I can tell you what I think about this, if you're interested . I think that all these stories about illegal immigrants, about true Jewish friendship and other nonsense - this is just an excuse. Roots, as for me much deeper. I think that the reason for the abuse of Ukrainians was the fact that in 2016 Ukraine voted in the UN Security Council for resolution 2334, which condemns all acts of terror against civilians and says that Israel must get out of the Palestinian territories, which are occupied by Israel, on which they set up settlements in flagrant violation of international law. I think that the adoption of this resolution was the result of the fact that Israel, before that, threw the United States when it denied the facts of bullying by the Israeli police against civilians. There is documentary evidence of this.
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4.5
answered 5 years ago
I simply brought this information to Mikhail, since in the previous correspondence there was this - "... the presence of some" serious visa of a serious country "(I exaggerate, of course) would be a good excuse for a pass to Israel at the moment. Therefore, I pinned It's hard to come up with a more serious visa.
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answered 5 years ago
linsrvc It's just that they cannot openly say this to the Americans, after which, of course, there will be consequences, but you can wipe your feet on Ukraine. In short, Israel chose the easiest prey. It's like playing games at the lowest levels. I believe that an order has been given from above to humiliate and mock people who are Ukrainians, some even very likely do not support the position of the state of Ukraine in the UN Security Council and, as a result, they clearly do not deserve such an attitude towards themselves. This is their mistake, and I would recommend that the Jews be careful with the choice of enemies, otherwise it may lead to the fact that from nowhere they themselves will sow and their beautiful country will be covered with a copper basin.
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answered 5 years ago
Yes. Did not write about the cost of the tour "for the British." I affirm - it is absolutely not more expensive, in transport per person 15-16 (or even less), than for people from the former CIS in a packed crowd (42 people). It's just that the attitude to the conduct and schedule of the tour is definitely different. And this despite the fact that the British give out 100% less tips than all other tourists... :) tour operators will not miss their where you can collect more money.
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2.5
answered 5 years ago
Well, I think it’s also worth reminding Mikhail, who loved the country with all his heart, that in 70 years the desert has become a garden in many places, not only thanks to the first 100 thousand immigrants to the divided Palestinian territory, but also to the multimillion-dollar infusions of the United States.
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answered 5 years ago
"It's hard to imagine a more serious visa."
Yeah well, bullshit. It was you who did not receive a visa from Turkmenistan or Saudi Arabia.
Yeah well, bullshit. It was you who did not receive a visa from Turkmenistan or Saudi Arabia.
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1
answered 5 years ago
Alias_Motto, who should I discuss with??? With this, I conclude that the Jews are a deceitful and rotten rabble, among which there are only a few good ones. Or with this - I do not call the whole nation rotten at all and do not claim that this is exactly what it really is.
The Jews guard their home, and you the resolution.UN. You can continue to speak beautifully and stupidly .. and even get likes for it. You are supported by the people, you were given a tribune... so maybe this is the reason???
The Jews guard their home, and you the resolution.UN. You can continue to speak beautifully and stupidly .. and even get likes for it. You are supported by the people, you were given a tribune... so maybe this is the reason???
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1.5
answered 5 years ago
mishatour
I don’t name, I don’t approve, but I think that’s how I voiced my opinion and it is indicated there. And I, it seems, indicated that I divide the Jews into good and bad, unfortunately the latter are the vast majority. I speak for modern Jews, citizens of Israel, to make it more clear. I don’t know, of course, what exactly hooked you, well, deceitful - he is deceitful. There was no court decision, there were bullying, my children's passports were defaced, and now, of course, you need to say something, well, all sorts of dirt is being poured, which is used to pour with impunity, it is the majority, and not those who disagree with you. Decayed? - well, I cannot consider the majority to be developing and progressive, even if it simply tolerates such antics of its representatives. Well, cattle - it is cattle in Africa, it even seems there is nothing to discuss here. You are not guarding your house - according to the UN resolution - you are invaders of someone else's house. Whatever reason you think I'm here for, the real reason is that I won't let you wipe your feet on my kids.
I don’t name, I don’t approve, but I think that’s how I voiced my opinion and it is indicated there. And I, it seems, indicated that I divide the Jews into good and bad, unfortunately the latter are the vast majority. I speak for modern Jews, citizens of Israel, to make it more clear. I don’t know, of course, what exactly hooked you, well, deceitful - he is deceitful. There was no court decision, there were bullying, my children's passports were defaced, and now, of course, you need to say something, well, all sorts of dirt is being poured, which is used to pour with impunity, it is the majority, and not those who disagree with you. Decayed? - well, I cannot consider the majority to be developing and progressive, even if it simply tolerates such antics of its representatives. Well, cattle - it is cattle in Africa, it even seems there is nothing to discuss here. You are not guarding your house - according to the UN resolution - you are invaders of someone else's house. Whatever reason you think I'm here for, the real reason is that I won't let you wipe your feet on my kids.
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2.5
answered 5 years ago
In 1933 one with exactly the same views came to power and we all know what came of it, and the Jews in particular. There, too, once someone offended someone. There is no justification for your words and views. One of the reasons for the creation of the State of Israel was the creation of a refuge for all Jews. Today, Jews defend what they have created, sometimes these methods are not quite popular and are condemned by UN resolutions. But there is no way out!!! When the pre-election program of presidential candidates contains the point of destroying the state of Israel, the UN becomes just an empty ring for the Jews. Israel has no antagonism either to the Ukrainians, or to the Georgians, or to the Belarusians, etc. Illegal workers undermine the country's economy. Lyuda, if all skillful hands come to Israel and work for a penny, then our skillful hands will receive unemployment??? I am not an economist, so I explain on my fingers in the hope that you will understand.
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answered 5 years ago
Yes, your children were not allowed. You and I do not know the reason, but judging by your story, I can conclude (maybe I am wrong) that they behaved defiantly and did not answer the questions posed. In any case, care for children can be shown in other ways without offending the whole people.
When on a tour they ask me why the Jews crucified Jesus, I say that he himself sacrificed himself in order to save people like you and me. Jews are not always to blame, but people are good and bad. You are an adult and it is not for me to tell you about it.
I'll make it clear right away that I'm not nominated for an Oscar. Although one of the films that won this award, I recommend watching it is Schindler's List.
When on a tour they ask me why the Jews crucified Jesus, I say that he himself sacrificed himself in order to save people like you and me. Jews are not always to blame, but people are good and bad. You are an adult and it is not for me to tell you about it.
I'll make it clear right away that I'm not nominated for an Oscar. Although one of the films that won this award, I recommend watching it is Schindler's List.
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answered 5 years ago
mishatour
Michael, do you want to deceive me or yourself? You couldn't think of anything better than comparing me to a psychopath who destroyed millions and brought so much grief. Are you adequate at all? Of course, this is unacceptable, to say the least. As far as my views and words are concerned, they do not need justification. And you know that your conclusion about my children is a statement that contains two assumptions and requires proof, and you do not have any, therefore it is a lie. I don’t understand why you do this, you are making things worse for yourself? I want to give you advice and, of course, I want you not to be offended by me. I advise you to honestly look at all this and admit that Israel did wrong in relation to my children. You may not listen, of course, but I think that this is your only correct choice, if you can call it that.
Michael, do you want to deceive me or yourself? You couldn't think of anything better than comparing me to a psychopath who destroyed millions and brought so much grief. Are you adequate at all? Of course, this is unacceptable, to say the least. As far as my views and words are concerned, they do not need justification. And you know that your conclusion about my children is a statement that contains two assumptions and requires proof, and you do not have any, therefore it is a lie. I don’t understand why you do this, you are making things worse for yourself? I want to give you advice and, of course, I want you not to be offended by me. I advise you to honestly look at all this and admit that Israel did wrong in relation to my children. You may not listen, of course, but I think that this is your only correct choice, if you can call it that.
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answered 5 years ago
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